Carl S Build Diary
Turbo Mini Forums

Well, to keep spirits up, I thought I would dig out all my supplies for the up coming EFI build which I am doing within the next few months.

I'm planning to fit a Megasquirt II ECU, along with an MPi manifold to my 1990 Mayfair which has a 998cc engine. The car will be NA, so maybe not as fun as could potentially be, but I will happily stick to non-turbo for now :). I am hoping to get all the EFi equipment installed before the summer starts so that I can get it out on the road and start making progress with regards to tuning.

My long term aim is to get the injection timing down to an art, so that I can distribute my findings (in the form of maps, or .msq files) to other people who wish to fit an MPi manifold to there 998 engined mini, so that they can have a useable setup from the word go. This is why I have chosen to keep things as standard as possible, so that very few variables affect the state of tune when it comes to applying it to different vehicles and engines, and hopefuly only minor adjustments will be needed!

Here's a few photos of what I have so far for the build:





I've made a list of all the other things I need to complete my stockpile before I start fitting it all to the mini. This includes all the wiring and relevant gubbins!

I'll get some photos of the car and engine bay when i've returned to Stafford (home in Devon for easter!)

Edited by Carl S on 10th May, 2010.

Just a thought, why not try and get an injection fuel tank, and the fuel lines from an injection car? Then you have a nice and easy OE installation.

Tom has a valid point....
Just look at my build thread to see how much hassle I've had fitting it all to a standard setup.

It can be done but it's not easy.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

I'm assuming you had hassle because you added a return port to the fuel tank Rod?

Adding the return port to the tank wasn't that bad - I had a spare tank that had been empty for years so was safe to weld.
But,
1 - running the new pipes took ages to get right. I used 8mm and 10mm copper and followed the same route as the original 6mm steel one. And I had the luxury of the shell on its side.....
2 - mounting the pump and filter assembly was the worst bit by far. I wanted the pump and filter below the tank and "outside" the car (safety reasons) and it was a real pain to cram it all in between subframe and boot floor.

I assume the MPI pump is inside the tank ???

EDIT - there "might" be a slight issue with using the actual MPI pipes (not an issue with the tank, just the pipes). I rememeber when I was looking up prices of floorpans a while ago, there is a seperate listing for MPI which I "think" is different chanels/clips as I think the pipes take a different route. Not 100% certain but worth checking if you did think about using them.

Edited by Rod S on 4th Apr, 2010.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

std 998 A+, g295, MD266, RHF4, 109hp @0.8bar/5400rpm

I used an SPI tank and uprated the pump. It was very straightforward.

The later carb cars have a different pipe support arrangement but run the same route. The support clips can hold two pipes. For the return I just fitted a piece of 10mm OD microbore into the existing clips.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

On my '92 carbed 1275, there is already a line that would be suitable as a return line.

It is for the canister that is located I believe under the front LH wing.

Problem is if I use it this way, I have no more canister ...

I guess it is just a matter of converting back to old school definition : use the floor as a canister ...

My point being your '90 Mini might have this line fitted ?

Rusty by nature

I found this photo.



The vent pipe is just connected up to keep the MOT guys happy. It is not connected at the other end.

I think that the vent pipe is too small for a return.

You can see the 10mm OD microbore that I fitted in the empty slots of the clips.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Unfortunately, my mini doesnt have that extra line fitted Advantage, so that's a no go for me.

The clips which hold the current fuel pipe to the floor pan are the wide flap type retainers, so I will probably end up B clipping or P clipping the two new pipes in to place, along the original fuel pipe run.

I forgot to bring my camera back to Stafford like a twonk so it won't be till early May that I get any more photos!

I don't have those fancy proper clamps in Paul's photo either, just the flap type retainers.
As the flap type have both narrow bits and wide bits I managed to secure both an 8mm and a 10mm copper pipe along the original run.

It was just very time consuming getting all the bends right....

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

OK small update, some shots of the car it's all getting fitted to:





Still getting little bits and pieces off of ebay and other places to get everything together before I start fitting it.

However, a dilema now ensues. I'll need the car for work in Worcester starting from July, and i'm going to be away for quite a while after next week, so I cant decided whether to rush fit it and hope that it works off the bat, or whether I should wait untill the car is not being relied uppon so that I can get it fitted in good time and iron out any problems?

Is it mandatory to add an S to your username when you build an injected mini ?

Rusty by nature

I think that it's a scarey coincidence that we all have second names beginning with S, haha.

Actually Graham is a "T" but I suppose that's as close as you can get.....

Re the dilema question, looking at what you've got I wouldn't have thought it would take long to swap carb to MS or back again.

It looks like you already have MJ as I can see a coilpack so the trigger wheel is already there and if you've run the fuel lines you could install the electric high pressure pump and still run the carb by using a low pressure regulator (like the Metro Turbo one but leaving the boost sensor connection open to atmosphere) which would allow you to test out the high pressure fuel system while still running a carb.

As you have MJ, you could install the phase sensor in the dizzy position and test it out while stilll running the carb (just let it flash an LED) which is the area where Graham (T) had problems.

You could still install the widebands (if you haven't already) and run the carb (see just how bad a carb is !!!) and get it all working and data logging setup.

You could install the MS and wiring loom but just not power it up while still running the carb.

Then to do the swap it should just be inlet manifold/carb off in one go and swap the fuel lines and plug everything in. I would think you could do that and back to a carb again in less than a day if everything was prepared to give both options.

A bit like a lot of people leave the dizzy in with MJ in case things don't go as planned.

EDIT - the other point, is the MS finished and tested on a JimStim so you can familiarise yourself with all the settings in TunerStudio ???

My initial problem was not understanding what all the settings mean in the siamese code, some are not "intuitive".....

But with a lot of help from Paul and Jean on how to set it up before trying it on the engine, I had the engine running in less than 1/2 hour. It's just a shame the car (still) isn't finished......

EDIT 2 - and rather than installing the MJ and not powering it while still on a carb, you could let it replace the MJ by setting the msq for ignition only and hence get all your VR circuitry tested and set up right and sort out all the dwell/charge times. You could also then use the MS for logging the widebands and get used to all that functionallity.

I think Paul and Graham both ran ignition only at first.

Edited by Rod S on 11th May, 2010.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Thanks Rod, that's a fantastic post.

Someone on the forum has purchased my megajolt box off of me so I will have to place the MS in the car functioning as ignition only for a little while so that I can get everything else sorted out.

I've been using MS with a JimStim along with TunerStudio for past few months now and would like to think I understand what's going on, the only part that is not finished on the box is the second wideband input for logging, but I will get this added ASAP. Apart from that, it just needs the two end plates fastening on and then the connector wired up.

I would like to do the fuel system whilst keeping the carb but I dont have a regulator to hand (I did have but sold it a long while back), so that will have to come along the same day as I fit the injection manifold.

The only things that are really holding me back right now is that the vacuum take off is broken on the manifold (snapped where it meets the non-return valve), and I dont have a flange to take off a MAP signal to the MS box (but one is in the works, just need to get measurements from the original MAP sensor location securing holes).

As for the phase sensor, this is also a case of getting it made, but hopefuly I can get it done quite soon, as I know someone local to me who access to a couple of lathes and CNC machines.


You're right though, once I see the big picture, there isnt all that much to do, and a lot of it can be done whilst keeping the carb in position. I do plan to fit the wideband sensors whilst keeping the carb in place so that I can make a comparison to when injection is fitted.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

EDit - Actualy, I wouldn't worry about it Rod, it shouldnt be too much trouble to sort the fuel system out on the same day.

Cheers for the offer though.

Edited by Carl S on 11th May, 2010.

No problem just PM me if you change your mind and want to try it first.

Otherwise keep us posted on how the ignition only, VR setup, phase sensor, and dual widebands and data logging go...

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Another small update, sorry there is not much in terms of 'business end' updates, but it's very much on the right track now.

Managed to remove the inlet and exhaust over the last two days (took so long as one of the manifold nuts was an absolute swine, took over an hour to get it off!). Now the exhaust is with a friend of mine getting the lambda bosses welded on, so that should be back with me in a few days. Whilst everything is out of the way, I thought I would try trial fitting the injection manifold, and here are the results:




I had to remove the locator rings from the manifold as the ports on the head are substantially smaller then the ports on the manifold, hopefuly this wont cause too much issue.

Whilst the exhaust was off, I thought that I might as well get a look at the space I have to work with for the fuel system setup, and whilst doing so descovered a rather mangled vent pipe going to nowhere? The end of the pipe is completely perished and split so lord knows what happened to it:


Edit - I forgot to mention, I wonder if anyone could tell me the purpose of those two hose barbs in the front centre of the manifold?

Edited by Carl S on 13th May, 2010.

Don't know about the MPI manifold (never seen one) but the "vent" in the photo above is just like mine, it's from the top of the fuel tank (but mine is nylon tube so looks better) and is from the earlier models where the tank just has an open vent.

Later models have the tank vent routed to the front of the car to a proper charcoal absorbtion canister. I'm actually thinking of re-doing mine, not to the front of the car, but to an absorbtion cannister of some sort rather than just an open vent as I've routed my high pressure return to the top of the tank (very close to where the vent is) rather than the "Tee piece trick" so I will probably be venting a lot of vapour. Over the last 2-3 weeks I've been test running the fuel system occasionally (to ensure there are no leaks) and always end up witha strong smell of petrol under the rear of the car after running the pump even though the system is totally leak-free.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Another small update, but unfortunately the last for a little while now.

I've now got the lambda sensors fitted in to the exhaust, fitted with copper sheet heatsinks to aid cooling, as can be seen here:


The car is now fitted with the carb once again so that I can get it driveable and through its MOT next week.

Unfortunately, because i've not been able to get the custom bits I need made up to install the MPi manifold, i'm going to have to wait untill I next have time off before I can fully fit it, so for now I'll just be running the squirt on ignition only and taking logs from the AFR readings.