Josh's turbo 1098cc carburetion sucks lets try EFI
Turbo Mini Forums

hmm well the alin bolt is maby 1/4" from the chain and the head is maby 4-5mm? from memory? ill try dig a picture up if i find one ill post it

the cam gears are duplex with multiple key ways the lightened ones with the holes in the cam gear form memory ther was nothing in the line of sight other than the alin bolt except the boles but thoes went all the way round about 5 or 6 in total?



the red dot is about where the cam sender goes in the backing plate and the green dot is about where the alin bolt is on the gear wish i could find the actual pics with the bolt and backing plate


i really dont want to pull the cam gear off to swap the bolt out for a solid one but like you say it seams to far apart to be the bolt so really not sure yet

i looked on the logger zoomed right in and is 12.5ms between the two cam peeks a full cam cycle is 463.4ms its about 10-11 cam degrees apart from what i can work out

(plugs out cranking on the starter for log) turns out about 290 rpm cranking speed at least the log is good for something now i know

is there any smoothing or blending that can be added to the signal? i think you can add or subtract cam degrease if you burger up the position ?


ill see to getting a plug and lead set up on the number 1 coil pack and strobe it so just needs to be about 90 degrease btdc but how do i know its on the power stroke and not intake stroke? is it a case of just trying it and if it goes bang out the carb its 180 out? lol


i later pulled the dissy out to set the carb up but seems ive got a fuel porblem as it runs for half a second to a second then cuts out so gave up for the night i will see to it tomorrow first off il check the reg is giveing the 2-3psi then ill check the cab needle to bridge height and base setting for idle mixture becides that it really should run of the dissy when i know the carb will at least idle and rev with no load then ill try to run the coil packs and ms i think no point trying to tackle both fuel and ingnition at the same time my head will explode haha wish i had a know running carb not the rebuild one

cheers rod

one thing to add is it apares your log for the crank looks more consistant vs mine looks a bit closer and spread on the tooth timeing?

With MS3, you can apply Noise Filtering to the secondary tach signal (cam). That might get rid of the second cam spike.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

That new figure makes the allen bolt more likely.

For testing the crank 36.1 position with a carb, the cam (phase) is irrelevant if you are using a coilpack because it fires every revolution anyway (hence the term wasted spark).
The phase sensor (cam) is only important once you are on sequential injection or choosing to use individual COP or CNP or a coilpack with 4 individual coils.

Make sure you use a "dumb" timing light, not one of those with advance dialled in - wasted spark coilpacks confuse them...

The reason my composite log is better is because I just ran it from my spare MS2 and JimStim (that just happen to be next to my desktop) when I saw your post.

As Paul says, noise filtering may be worth a try.
Also, hopefully Jean sees this as the code may just ignore a double spike on phase, maybe it just puts loads of entries in the datalogs but accepts either as they are before the missing tooth ???

Personally I'd take the pain and put the bolt in the other way around..... (end to Hall switch rather than head).

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Unfortunately, I don't know what the code does exactly and I haven't checked. I know that the part of the code for the crank signal simply checks if a cam signal has been seen when it detects a missing tooth but I don't know if the code for the cam signal does more validation.

Having said that, the composite log pictured does not show any loss of sync so that may be fine. That's as long as the second pulse never crosses the missing tooth.

http://www.jbperf.com/

hmm

the logger shows no sync loss at the cranking rpm but who knows what it will do between 2-300rpm and 6krpm

i seem to have a fueling problem.. think ive got it down to the float level or needle and seat

so off with the head! thats actually easier than getting the exhaust/intake off and it has a side affect that should let me get the cam sender out then the bolt threw the hole

as for checking the ignition im running 4 coils so it not wasted spark that said i think im confident ive got it on the correct phase and if not i belive paul s had a stuff up and fixed it up just fine in ms so think im hapy to jet check its got spark at tdc and advances acording to the map in ms

OK, I hadn't realised 4 coils, I thought Paul was the only one using individuals.

An easy check of your phase if you have the head off and sensor out is if you turn the engine so you can see the bolt you should be approx 120 BTDC with No1 on the compression stroke and No4 on the exhaust stroke so just drop the two end pushrods down their holes and the No1 end pushrod should be low and the No4 end one higher as No4's exhaust valve would be 2/3 or more open if the head was on.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

err decided id pull the carb off and leave the head and both manifolds on so ive fixed the fueling problem now and its really good (not ran under load tho) the hif44 uv the old hs2 really wants to rev now! anyways

now ive for the most part lost the dam crank signal now its all over the place but still have the same cam signal as i did have before so at a miss why the crank has buggered up?

i think ill run with the cam phase and if its wrong ill deal with it then i cant rember if i put a locking nut on the inside for the phase sender the last thing i want is an M12x1 nut floating round the timeing cover so not game to try take it out the backing plate

id gotten my self all excited to check the phase sender was right and convert to the coils not disy there fore get the rad in and beable to run the engine for more than 30seconds frustrating how it was giveing a good crank signal and now its messed up gah time for a scotch i think

is there a guide on using the logging part of things it may be good if i can take a decant log and post it to see if that can help with understanding what the heck is going on?

tomorow ill try see if i can load ms on the settings that where when it gave good crank signals?

If you go to the MS-E forums you will find that James (JSMcortina) has updated loads of the MS manuals and they really are quite good now.

For basic logging of all the data (not the tooth or composite logger) just enable it in TunerStudio and it will create a file that is easily viewable in Megalogviewer (I just use the free version) or you can dump it to a spreadsheet. That file will contain the reasons for any loss of synch in the form of an error code number and at what other physical conditions (ie, RPM, and just about everything else).

A simple screenprint of your (now) composite log might help.
The one you posted first was absolutely fine on crank signal.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

right well it seams the crank signal is getting intrupeted possibly getting confused with the dual phase signal so im going to try the filtering on that and hope it fixes the inturptions

forgot to get the timeing light onto the no1 coil and check its at the same as what ms says in the instant viewr thing

if the phase signal filtering works and ms is in time with the cam for ing ill go ahead and bet it all tidyed up as if its on the road properly as i dont like running it with the block and head simply filled with water and no actual rad just going threw the bypass round and round

ive taken a log hope the link works not sure how to vew the reason for sync loss? but ive found how to show when it has and the count also can be seen by the rpm drop

well it runs on ms but....

first thing is im waiting on my MSD ignition leads to come maby Tuesday?
i say that because ive dogeyed up some wire to see if it would work basically and well it fired so thought heck ill get the strobe out and see where ms is vs when it really is on the damper mark so at forst it was 25-26! at 1100-1200 rpm! ms said it was like 18? anyways shut it down and power cycled ms restarted the car and it was matching ms real time display?? not sure

the other thing is its loseing sync now this i think is the phase signal and i want to look at the softwere side of it before pulling the thing apart if i can it may be partly the boged plug leads but will see when thoes come early this week

the attachment didnt work last time so going to try again for the logs im kinder getting useto looking at logs and getting around tuner studio

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well its more than happy to rev out now about time...

so waiting on minisport.com to freight my valves and a few small bits out pissed of as fuck i payed for them back on 23/11/14 some 2 months ago! id have had the cylender head done and on the dam car by now possibly on the road..

so when the dam valves arive i can do the combustion chambers and have the seats cut and pressed into the head then ill blend the un cut seats into the chamber and port then it will go back to the head guy for new guides and the actual valve job a bit of back and forth but it will save me from screwing the brand new seats up if i slip easy to blend the seats in when there not cut just the cylindrical insert then have the guys cut the seats on after im done with the grinder

grrr wheres my dam valves!!!!!!!!!!

thought id show some pics and a short vid

ive still got to tidy up a load of things but seen as ive got to take this head off and all the turbo kit to gain a roadworthy cert and rego im not to fussed with it to much although i plan to paint the bay and do the finishing touches to make it look decant not that i really care what it looks like so long as it goes! after all no one should be looking under the hood... mostly just so mates dont hang shit on me for an ugly engine bay

so next is to take the turbo kit off and get it ready for the new head and N/A form for rego then the turbo kit can go on and i can then finally drive it again

anyways some of my parts are supposedly on there way with the remainder sent out when they come in at no extra cost witch im happy with so should get the head parts soon and get cracking with that

few small things to fix like the wiper motor has gotten some water in it at some point i found this out when checking all the normal electrical work like lights signals wipers ect turned the switch and they moved a bit and stoped with a nasty crackle ohh crap what the heck had a poke and took it apart to find the auto park plate all rusted up and the brushes all twisted up they mush have gotten cought up in the russty stuff and been pulled around so need some parts for that

get it up on ramps and connect the rev sw up

replace the drivers side headlamp as low beam is blown so need a H4 lamp

make a box for the air filter so junk from the road stays out of the filter seen how its breathing in the wheel arch due to space

look at what i wired the 2nd wideband o2 sensor into as its not recording that in the logs

screw shifter boot down

find a v reg for the back of the dash cluster

cut some alu sheet for a dash and paint to keep the glare down mount gauges in





click to view last one is vid

ok so took it for a short road test and well it dies when boost is about to come in it felt like the ignition got turned off so went back home

looked at the log and well the afr is wank its all over the place
its hard for me to tell but it looks like it goes lean before the revs climb i really need to sort a TPS to give a better idea on what the throttle is doing

but anyway i think this is caused by me having the carb bowl vent open to atmosphere now this "should be blocked off" but i did that and the thing ether got zero fuel and wouldn't run and some times fuddled the engine so i un blocked it and it ran fine but seems when boost come in it pushes the fuel back into the bowl down the jet tube?

so what i did was "t" the bowl vent into the plenum/fuel reg signal line now i took a log altho not driving just gave the clutch a hard time with the hand brake on in like 3rd gear not good i know but couldn't go out for a propa run anyways under that little bit of load and rpm it seams its now not going lean like it was but this is guess work really i need to get it back out and go for a roll down the road

not sure i might try blanking it off again like most people do and what is recomended as when i had it blanked off and had the under/over fuel problem i had just fired the car up for the first time and it was all day the lines carb litrialy just put fuel in the tank set the regulator and turned the key so maby there was some stupid air lock going on it the bowl as the jet is submerged in the bowl and i think the fuel pumped in untill the jet was covered but because there was air traped in the top the fuel just pushed out the jet tube and didnt fill the bowl to lift the float?? just by theroy that the air got traped in the top and wouldent let the bowl fill to lift and close the needle and seat but the float stayed down and pumped fuel out the jet tube

maby now its full and the float is where it should be it maby be ok to block the thing off? donno

i wana try the T as i think the bowl should beable to vent so if it works ill run it like that

edit actualy i think i might try a run down the road with the boost pipe disconected to rule out the fuleing over all and see that it is caused but the effecs of boost comeing on

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Edited by Turbo This.. on 2nd Feb, 2015.

sorry can't help you out at all.. too many gizmos and doohickeys for me, but keep at it, it is looking good, just have to get it running half as well as it looks and she will be a beaut

well we have boost only 5-6 pound (current Watergate spring) cant wait to get this cylinder head finished and get the thing tuned up and add some more boost

seems i might need to rearrange the charge cooler rad or make it so either MAT or CLT can turn the fan on and pull the temp down it dose lose MAT in a reasonable time when the car gets moveing it drops to with in a few degrees of ambient so pleased with that i guess
need more road testing really to say if im going to change it or leave it
for now ive just set the MAT ING curve to pull timing out when the MAT gets hotter than id like so just dosent make as much power when the MAT is up

AFR is still all over the place but that could be partly the oil there getting from the shit valve guides and seals

going to work on the head for the rest of the day and maby get it dropped into the shop for guides, seats and a face cut later in the week

seems the old T3 might get thrown in the bin for favor of a nice ball bearing one we will see

i need to learn a bit more about tuning with MS3X before i go fooling around in it anymore lots of fun but i dont want tears..

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Edited by Turbo This.. on 16th Feb, 2015.

Good progress.

From the previous update (which I missed) you really do need to get TPS on the datalog.

From the very limited tests I did with a carb and dual widebands (a long time ago) I see pretty much the same, AFRs generally 1 - 1.5 apart one way around but occasionaly they converge or reverse.

In my case it was when the throttle was closed - which implies "sucked off wall" (the opposite of wall wetting) - but trying to guess what was happening to your throttle from RPM and MAP alone isn't easy.

Also, once you get the carb better setup the steady state offset should be easier to see which will make it easier to dial out once you switch to injection.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

1152cc turboed mini clubman, most powerful 1.1L a-series?

http://boostmini.justboard.net/

Rod s

yeah hope to get the TPS sorted soon as now ive got it boosting and wanting to take logs that mean something i really think it will be a good reference along side the MAP readings

Benjamin

Im confident the genuine su gasket i used had two holes so to make it idiot prof in terms of direction

i must have missed a passage way or the dam mud wasps got in there and built a nest either way the "T" has sorted it and i think thats how it will stay as carb is temporary stepping stone



so finally gotten some good service from a shop i ordered and payed via paypal some bits to get the road worthy stuff sorted like new rea lights and wiper motor parts bla bla and low and behold less that 2 days i had them in my hands grate stuff minisport south Australia

errr working in the dark gave up for the night due to the wiper motor "park" position being up not down not really sure what ive done wrong but i had it apart to replace the park ring bit and the brushes that go with it anyways i think i did that fine and correct so hopeing and thingking ive just gotten my wires on the plug wrong as under the dash its a pain to get to ill look at it some more maby tomorow

hopefully get a dash sorted soon aswell the cars never had one the whole time ive had it so be a change to have one haha kinda need to see the afrs and vac boost gauges

gotta look at the track and wheel alignment stuff as 7.25 pound waste gate springs made the steering wheel a bit light haha fun stuff

boost comes in a bit slow for my likeing aswell so maby some better ignition tuneing can get it to be more of a on/off thing rather than take like 2000 rpm range to go from 0-7.25 donno might have a leak somewhere donno
early days and i had a fair bit to think about for the first 2 trips just down the road a few meters

need an alternator/water belt tensionor as the dam belt is slipping new belt so maby just a tighten?

heads well on the way its not going to be what i wanted but still should get the job done

got plenty to do thats for sure !!

Must be cool to get it running...

I run a supercharger and I don't care the TB is on the wrong side.
VEMS + 12 PSI + Liquid Intercooler = Small Bore FUN!

it is after years of it sitting there not moveing

well ive been well side tracked bought a 4x4 and been messing around with that a bunch

turboed the 2.4 diesel and now working on intercooling it to bring the IAT down as i was seeing 105+c manifold temp and pre turbo EGTS upto 650c bot to high for comfort but the power increese is grate im a bit hooked on diesels now tbh so IC should pull the temps down near the 50-70c mark i hope and also the EGTs should drop 100-200c or so as a result i hope but anyways this is not a toyota forum just letting the few who may care know so back to the mini

been boosting around in the mini a bit few days after work here and there loveing it i badly need to get back into the head work n finish it off all ave gota do now is spend a day or so blending and matching ports,bowls,combustion chambers and then its right for the guides and seats to be cut then back for the final seat blending work after that a matter of swapping heads out and a little modification to raise the crank case breather up some more as its air/oil mix is wetting the breather a little maby a ring seal problem maby its just to low i dont know yet first thing will be to raise the thing up some as compression seemed fine via comp tester

since the last outing it seems ive blown the gasket between 3-4 no pressurized coolant or oil in water crap just a bit of knock in engine did a comp test and conformed 3-4 leakage also did a leak down and comformed no coolant or oil leakage so is just between cylenders just hope its not damaged the block dont care about the head jut the block
its no surprise as it was a re used an old BK gasket and knowing the stock head was twisted slightly i feel i should not be worried as it happened litarly less than 500m from home so thinking the block should not be burnt where it blew well i hope..

its been parked since partly due the the 4x4 as im wanting to sell it so been working on it to get it gone and then i can look at the mini again ive only got space for 1 car to work on at a time

4x4 flexed up in a wash out that ledge is about 2 feet high where the rea wheel is


disappointed by the fitment of minspares keepers...




picked up some sweep valves

so fars chamber work not finished


unfinished intake

Alright so the heads back and im happy with it grate price and work

it was nerve racking blending the seats out to surrounding areas all i can say is if i didn't have the dermal with there flex head id have buggered it up for sure i just ran the stone fairly slow to avoid jump
shape your stone to make it easier to get those angles and be able to see clearly i used the bench grinder and ran the stone in the opposite direction works really well although probably not the way to do it

the only think im not sure on right now is the guides.. now the bronze ones seem shorter as the way i cut the ports around the boss was conservative not to cut to much meat from the guide support for heat transfer and stability but now with he guides in it seems ive not cut enough out? the tapered section is quite far down so now has a void with the sharp edge ive take a pic but its hard to see the its like |/ | the guide being "sunken" down a bit below the cast iron guide boss

my concern is the super sharp edge causing cracks and at the least poor air flow



whats the norm? have i simply just not cut enough meat out? is it fine to go and cut the boss down to where the major dia of the guide matches the boss?

so the chambers 28-29 cc that works out at about 10.5CR 170-180 cranking psi with the valve events

did a quick ink test to check id not buggered the seats up

That's pretty much how I cut the guide bosses on my 12G940. Those guides must be really short?

A sharp internal corner can be the starting point of a crack. A sharp external corner doesn't conduct heat well so if it were in the cylinder, could cause a hot spot possibly leading to pre-ignition. So neither should be a problem here. It may not be the best for flow, but it's better than the guide boss you took out!