Josh's turbo 1098cc carburetion sucks lets try EFI
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Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

perhaps there is some where i can wire it up that will take the resistive input?

or i might have to find a temp sender for use in oil that gives 0-5v

not sure i want to mess with the pcb unless its fool proof

rang the engine shop this arvo and the said "we have problems" i was like what the hell? they explained
during the dummy build for deck height the rods dont clear the block.. turns out the arp bolts are much taller than std
they came up with things like grinding the block and bolt head witch i expressed i was not to keen on
so i said can we sink the bolt head into the cap a touch to make the engine turn over with a bit of clearance? they said
so long as the bolt can thread in to the rod and the cap dosent get thin also said they will use a nice radused tool if this is the chosen route

any way has anyone had this problem using a std 1098cc crank rods and block with arp bolts? id think the 998cc should swing with lots to spare?

its a thick flange block if that matters?

Edited by Rod S on 15th Jan, 2014.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

brilliant so ill need to get the 2.49K resistors from the local electronics store tomorrow i can handle drop in n solder jobs haha


"As for your conrod bolts, I haven't a clue apart from, maybe, are they the right conrods for that block ? "

there are different rods for small bore? thought the 998cc and 1098cc used the same casting 5.75" rods? perhaps ive messed up and gotten some different ones and had all this work done to re bush, sized, lighten and strengthen them as well as other things

For the resistors get 1% tolerance metal film ones if you can (not the more common 5% or 10% carbon film ones). These are what are used on the V3.0 mainboard for the temperature bias resistors, the 1% means your reading will be much more accurate and metal films don't drift in value as much when their surronding temperature changes.

Conrods was a wild guess, I only ever rebuilt one 1100 engine many, many years ago and that was A series (not A plus) so the clearance was a bit better.

You might be better posting that specific question in the "help needed" or "technical" section as more people probably read there than the "show us yours".

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

ok will see if i can get the good 1% ones cheers for the heads up

shall do also include more specific info

well ive plumbed the fuel system up and feed up with it.. twin tanks are a pain if they are not genuine!!

the aftermarket tank has its outlet like 1/8 the way up so you need to have a whole bunch of fuel in it for the pump to draw from it

turns out the 10L i put in 5 each is dead weight and can never be sucked up from the pump.. gahh

think i need to sort the outlet in a proper place like the bottom...

rod ive gotten some 2.4k ones as that was as all they had will the 0.09k be much difference? this is the actual measured value

or should i get a 0.09k and put them in series to get the 2.49k ? or any other combo for that matter..

Josh,

Mathematically, left alone, it will be about 3.5% out.

But on the MS-E website somewhere is a nice spreadsheet of the Steinhart-Hart equation which allows you to enter alternative bias resistor values and will give you the new calibration curve so you only have to enter three new temperature/resistance values into the MS, just like if you used a non-GM sensor or different resistor in the first place (like I do) and all will be good.

I'll try and dig out the link later (I don't have the link readily to hand as I already have the spreadsheet on my HDD as I use non-GM sensors).

Rod.

EDIT - can't find the link so PM me your email address and I'll send you the spreadsheet from my HDD (I'll adjust it for your value) or, if you don't want to re-calibrate the MS3, PM me you postal address and I'll send you a few 2.49s
Postage might take 7-10 days, so it depends on how much of a hurry you're in.

Edited by Rod S on 25th Jan, 2014.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

cheers rod your a top bloke appreciate it

regarding the problems ive been having with my fuel tanks and related parts turns out it just was lack of fuel in the darn tanks... the lines,pump, filters red bla bla hold quite a bit
it turns out that the tanks only hold about 2 L each when the pump sucks air i found this out when i pulled the tank and only tipped out 2 odd L haha so tank back in the way it was and put more fuel in all is well ...

darn shops are closed so cant get the pats i wanted so my nice Tial MVS 38mm V Band Wastegate will have to wait got it for next to half price 42% discount happy days

Josh, spreadsheet sent by email.

I'd forgotten last night, with the recent versions of TunerStudio, you don't have to use the spreadsheet any more, you can change the bias resistor value in TS and let it re-generate the tables for you.

I've explained in the email.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

nothing really happening as work is flat to the boards...

shop is SLOWLY getting stuff done.. but at least they are taking the slow steady route not wam bam

so the point of this is they are asking a bunch of questions that i gave rough answers that i said id conform then get back on

right so regarding the oil cooling jets/squirters they said that to get them to point where u want them we need to turn the spout 180 ie mount the thing upside down basicaly aparntly the things are supost to be all right hand or left hand mount not two LHS two RHS like has been done in the past? anyway

next thing is they say they feel the boor might swell or distort a bit due to being kinda thin?

also said they dont feel to comfortable with the water ways and running into them?

another thing was cutting the "flats" for them to sit on they are sort of reluctant to cut much of the crank case away and they whould like to use a radus cutter witch i agree but think that we could cut a fair bit into the crank case?

not real sure what to do i want the oil cooling jets so i can wind the boost up like 20+ psi as i want this thing to move! if its slow im going to cry!

i think i truse the guys to do it right and not screw it up as they are sort of picking holes, pokeing n proding evrything with the intent to get it right the first time addute

all that needs doing is the jets, piston buttons, piston cooling jet releve if need be, final ballance rotating assembly, cleand block and cam bearings they say all going well ill have it back friday but ive been told id have if back sevral times over haha

altho i dont care so long as its done right and dont cost the earth...

I have seen a groove machined into rods that directs oil up at the piston, there is a pic on this link
http://www.contour.org/ceg-vb/showthread.p...nyone-have-info

Speeding is like masturbating, everyone does it, but not all of us film it and put it on the internet

[quote=fab,8th Oct, 2010]fuck off

So ive picked up my parts from the shop at this stage ive got some questions regarding the shops work... ive given most parts a "first clean"

well pictures are worth a thousand words so here is a worth bunch!

yuck!


a bunch of pics after the first bath in cold soapy water then blasted with air then a hit with water dispersant still need a lot more thorough cleaning...

the rods
i see that the shot penning has been done on the "thrust" face? is that surface supost to be like a journal and machined all nice?

i see that there are some "marks" around the place? they look to be the low places that did not clean up when re sized?





now i cant feel anything so im gussing that thease marks regarding the re size might just be stains and nothing to worry about since at the bearing joins perhaps its not a bad thing there be a little breathing room?

how ever the "thrush" face i can feel a messed up surface from both shot peening and the origanal garbge thats been pushed past at some point

had them strees releve and lighten the rods a bit but not sure on this mark its deep enugh to catch a pic or finger nail..



can i should i run a fine file across the bolt pads as they are all messed up and galled



the crank
same as rods there are some "marks" around the place? they look to be the low places that did not clean up when ground?
now will these give me problems? oil flow? potential for cracks? poor bearing fitment? excessive where? anything?

this is a tiny "pit" i guess i can feel it so not just a stain perhaps nothing to worry about since its on the thrust face?



here you may beable to see some dark bits on the radii now some are "deeper" than other but not sure if im freaking out over nothing? im paranoid about ending up with another 4th? cracked 1098cc crank! so anything at all that may cause problems i want to sort out!


here you can see a nice chip or nick this is my main concern..

al in all it seems the dark patches are just where the grind didnt quite clean up so should i see to haveing somthing done about this or run with it?



also for what ever reason they did not "clean up" the primary gear running surface like i had asked and to go with that the gear itsself dose not fit on is this a case of A+ crank and A gear? vise versa.. if so do i get the propper bushings or have the tail matched to my gear? its a floating type..


not yet yet ran any wet n dry emry papore over it but not sure whats going on as my primays gear whont fit anymore.. perhaps its an A+ crank with A gear?

i can catch a rule or finger nail on this so think somthing needs doing for sure?

for what ever reason ive not been given the "sized" bearings that are numbered for placement jurnal for jurnal and top for bottom halfs i do rember the call to say this crank is 10 or 20 not the 30 you have supliyed so do you want us to get bearings or will you supply them and i said you guys can get them also not sure if i said get the grove/plain type or not? anyway ill see to this on monday..

i want to do the idot checks with plaster gauge and what ever else i can to check the shops work...

a few pics of the crank i did ask them to take as much as cane safely but think id have liked to seen more taken anyway this is what it is..







defiantly on the safe side of metiral remval i think... perhaps not worth evan getting it done..

not sure on this key ether looks as someone has punched it to fatten it up hahah



had the lifter coated as the fit was kinder baggy but "ok" to run so chose to tighten them up a touch..



had some of thease guys made to rule out any chance of boor damage and also ease of fit up



pistons learanced for jets they where ballanced each for each after the fack...





oil cooling jets aparently one hell of a head ach...







not real sure on the angle of spray think ill mock it all up and pump kero throw it to see where they actualy hit also where it the best place to shoot for on the pistion and stroke? tdc bdc mid way? center of crown?




now im not sure on thease "new cam bearings... looks to be marks all over the place.. not the cam "sticks" when sat for a few seconds but if you "brake" it free it spins over reall nice.. this is just the cam installed with no gear backing plate or thrust plate.. normal? or possibaly a wonky bearing? seems to only "stick" when installed the last 1/4" or so if its pulled slightly out it "sticks" might make a vid of this to explain better if need be?








the caps have the same marks possibly just discoluration not cleaned up by the tooling?


not nessary to clean up the thrust face on caps?



now i was messing around and couldent mannage to get "full" lift on my cam?


reads .715 mm think full lift on the md274 is like 0.723?
http://www.kentcams.com/product-details/24...orts-Injection/

boors look good to me



the deck has been skimed just bearly by the looks of it also aparntly it wan not parralell ether? cant check out the rest of things till i get my "sized and numbered" bearings witch have not been supplyed yet haha hopefully just sitting on the bench and not been given to me..

checked the entire block over for raisebits useing a large file de burred all edges and holes cleaned all threads with a tap useing my fingers and minumal pressure quite easy actualy to "chase" a thread



all wraped up for a nap..




wow big wright up full of bad grammar and spelling but hey gets the point over somewhat?

cheers guys

well ive worked out the primary gear problem it was burs on the "c" washer grove stopping it sliding on
however its still not a very good surface to run my nice new gear on i dont think?
would it be a good idea to run a large flat fine file over it gently to knock any high bits off then use some wet and dry to polish it up?
if that wont cut it then i may have the crank tail ground and some new bushing made to correct the running clearance rather not go there tho..

I'll just give my views on a few of the bits you've mentioned, not everything...

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

I should probably add I would have explored all other possibilities if the pistons really do come that far down (before butchering the pistons) to get the jets lower.
You can't really use a whole stack of copper washers as the bolt wouldn't have too many threads left in the block, and you can't use a longer bolt (as the ball valve is built in) so I would have considered a male/female threaded extender, assuming that didn't cause clearance issues with the crank.
The thing is, although the piston skirt is relatively lightly loaded, that's the "thrust" face of it.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

hmmm, so its not just myself that is somewhat disappointed by the work then.. hopefully the shop dose the right thing as addresses my concerns with something decant rather than yeah she will be right.

in order to get the best oil clearance possible dont you install the bearings and then bore gauge them on at a bunch of places then pick and chose bearing shells to get the best fit up?

shall look at the key tomorrow

should something be done about the rod thrusts, crank grind and tunnel re sizing both main and rods?

ive not yet had the crank or rods in due to not having any bearings so not sure on how far the piston actually travels im guessing im holding it a fair bit lower due to pin location in bore

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

ok must jet be the really high end stuff that they do like that..

will a snap gauge suffice for internal diameters? cant afford a bore gauge haha

perhaps i could have a different shop look over the lot for me to be sure?

picked up my bearings this arvo and well the shells seem ok but the thrusts lock it up when niped up with a spanner not much tnesion at all... at this point i feel like giveing up with the "quality" of there work
i took the block half of the thrusts out and hey what do ya know it turns over i gently tourqed it up checking all the way it still moved and managed to get the full 80 fl lb so thinking this is due to the caps not being ground "straight" when line bored so when you pull the cap down its pushing the thrust onto the crank and wedjing it

ive not yet qustioned anything face to face with them but will be as soon as i can get some time off work as i want to see them mesure evrything up and sort out evrything that im not happy with so ive got no idea what the out come will be but i can only try

i also noticed the rods caps mateing faces are not right ether as you can catch your finger nail in the thrust face meaning when fitted on the crank you can get the 8 tho gauge down one side but not the other also the 12 tho fits in places too so seams the thrust is out side tolarance? book says 8-12 ive got a sloppy 12 in places maby 13

as i deal with customers evry day i know that jumping up n down yelling certanly dose not help the cause so will be trying the civalised way to come up with an outcome hopefully good

cranks only 10 n 10 so might see if they will grind it again along with the line bore and cap situation

i dont know its so frustrating thinking you whould get things back and they whould be right but things are not much better than when they went in i dont think lol the parts still cant be used imo

edit rembered that i forgot to say the piston dose actualy travle that far down the bore i reson if it came any ferther down the wrist pin whould start to show its face haha so the piston skirt clearance dept is justafiyed but the with is over kill also i may blend that area a bit better and balance weigh them up dont know..

Edited by Turbo This.. on 10th Feb, 2014.

If you had the main bearing caps mating surfaces refaced and the whole lot line bored/honed - which it looks as if you did (but I'm not sure) - the photos don't show any work on the bit where the thrusts sit.

What that could mean is that, although the centre main bearing housing is round again, the recess the thrust washers sit in won't be. It will have lost height.

The thrust washers are normally a pretty loose fit (vertically) in the recess but may now be getting nipped up and pushed outwards as you tighten the cap.

Assemble the centre main cap reasonably tight (no need for full torque) - with no crank and no main bearings - and just see if the thrust washers actually fit in their recesses as pairs with a bit of free movement up and down.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

ahh will do hadnt thought of that

yes i had the block line bored so the caps have been skimmed then made round again but they have not touched the thrust related bits so you may be right

ill have a look see tomorrow after work

once again the experience and knowledge on this forum pays off, rod was right in saying the thrusts might be tight..
so held them upright n took enugh off them to first free them up to a state where they whould go in and fall out then took a touch more so they could move slightly with the cap pulled down.


ive been mucking round getting the cam timed in so i can mark the key way slots on the gear set as ive got the ajestable ones

gotten my self all confused so called it a night haha think im a bit advanced as the intake is still open when the piston is like 70 degrease btdc so dosent seem to have any or much compression where it is

will check tomorrow

do what rod said about the thrust face on the main caps. on your conrods the part that didnt clean up is normal, sometimes you can put that crosshatch pattern on the whole rod, if your just sizing the rod, if you strip the rod and cap to much it starts to effect the rod center length. it looks like they used a pin boring machine on your rods, i used a pin boring machine and then finished them of and a sunnen rod honing machine to give that crosshatch pattern in the rod,
Did you get them to crack test your parts for you we use to crack test alot of cranks after grinding just to make sure nothing was wrong. if its a good shop they will write on the first counterweight the bearing size they gring to I.E 10m/10be 10m/20be

they would be using std knock in cam bearings, this means you have to scrap some of the bearing to get the cam to turn over, so some marks might be seen you can use some sotchbrite pad to light clean them if it worries you.

just remember use alot of wd40 or crc and alot of clean rags to wipe those bores clean, if you think your done a good enough job do it again. it amazing how dirty those bores are.

if your worried about the machining done on your engine take it somewhere else and ask then to check everything, and get them to dail the cam in for you.

i hope some of this helps you

if you where in vic i could have come over and had a look for you
rob

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