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Advantage

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1137 Posts
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Post Whore

Near Paris - France

No worries !

Let's not be too polite, it doesn't really suit the character ...

What's this fog and dish thing anyway ?

Rusty by nature

On 23rd Jun, 2008 paul wiginton said:

They said "That sounds rough mate." I said "Cheers it cost me a fortune to make it sound like that!"


Paul S

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8604 Posts
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Formerly Axel

Podland


On 20th Jan, 2011 Advantage said:
No worries !

Let's not be too polite, it doesn't really suit the character ...

What's this fog and dish thing anyway ?


The happy pills must be working :)

Fab's brilliant analogy of seeing something that is not necessarily there: "a dish of nothing, like fog".

I thought it must be French, hence the sig.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


Joe C

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12307 Posts
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Carlos Fandango

Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex

On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged...

Joe, do you have a photo of your tool?



http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1

https://joe1977.imgbb.com/



fab

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1497 Posts
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Parisien Turbo Expert

Paris\' suburb

Dear Paul,
"a dish of nothing like fog" doesn't exist as a french expression and doesn't tend to mean seing something that's not there.

It's more like:

Trying to hide the empty.You're the inspiration for it.

Certainly a bit complex as a lot of water have flow since his apparition, but don't care anymore, your antiquated neurons will not come thru this.

It make a very nice photo though.


Paul S

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8604 Posts
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Formerly Axel

Podland

*happy*

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


joeybaby83

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Isle of Man

your porridge is burning paul

"Turbo's make torque, and torque makes fun"

"did you know you can toast potato waffles?"



Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

Ah, so it's not empty after all *happy*

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


Willy_sa

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Member

Pretoria, South Africa

I take it I missed the end result? Or Paul can you maybe share some light on this?

1978 Clubman (soon to be S)
2011 Countryman Cooper


Brett

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Doncaster, South Yorkshire

They broke and sold before any real dyno time
Also belive they had an issue with fueling seem to remember a pump broke or fpr or something
If you have a search there is another thread or two

Yes i moved to the darkside *happy*

Instagram @jdm_brett


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

Podland


On 20th Aug, 2013 Willy_sa said:
I take it I missed the end result? Or Paul can you maybe share some light on this?


Still coming together but in a road car and a different spec engine in the planning.

Under wraps until finished and proven.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


John

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Mongo

Barnsley, South Flatcapshire

On 21st Aug, 2013 Paul S said:
Under wraps until finished and proven.


Boooo! But good luck!

If something is worth doing, it's worth doing half of.


madmk1

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5417 Posts
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Double hard bastard

brookwood woking

Vtec yo!!

I have started posting on Instagram also my name on there is turbomk1golf

Nothing is impossible it just costs more and takes longer.

On 1st Nov, 2007 Ben H said:
There is no such thing as 'insignificant weight saving', it all adds up.


Brett

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Doncaster, South Yorkshire




On 21st Aug, 2013 Paul S said:

Still coming together but in a road car and a different spec engine in the planning.


thats nice to know Paul, thought you had got the huff on with it all and sold up *happy*

Yes i moved to the darkside *happy*

Instagram @jdm_brett


danb41

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Oxfordshire

Any chance you can get the pictures back up Paul?

My build thread: http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=454802

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/85313398@N02/


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

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Here you go *smiley*

The reason the old links do not work is that I changed my ISP and the way that the folders referenced changed.


1293 manifold:










998 manifold:









The latest:

Edited by Paul S on 18th Oct, 2014.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


danb41

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Oxfordshire

Thanks for that Paul, very helpfull :)

My build thread: http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=454802

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/85313398@N02/


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

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We are currently working on the two cars that will have the tubular manifolds.

I've just been relocating the PDWA and brake lines on my 998, whilst Axel has been getting the engine out of the Racing Flame ready to take the 1293.

Hopefully have both cars on the road next year.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


danb41

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Oxfordshire

Good stuff, i will be keeping an eye out. Im thinking about making one now as i'm in the industry.

One thing i wanted to ask is what your take on having a step up in bore diameter on a manifold.

As nearly all motorsport systems i have seen made at the company i work for use this design.

My build thread: http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=454802

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/85313398@N02/


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

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Stepped headers are supposed to broaden the power band by anti-reversion. I'm sceptical about this and don't think it would make significantly more power. There is also the issue of finding tube and fittings of the right diameter.

A step in the diameter will cause a change to the pulse pattern in the manifold. Depending on other engine parameters, this could have a negative or positive effect. The trick is to get everything working together cam, head, turbo, manifolds so that their best contribution to making power occurs at the same point in the rev range.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


stevieturbo

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Post Whore

Northern Ireland

It would actually be nice to see the manifold over the top and dropping down into the turbo.

then the intake section would suffer less from heat soak, as the heat would rise away from it

Would also leave a little more room possible for the downpipe to escape

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


danb41

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Oxfordshire

Interesting, i wonder what particular effect it would have on power in the rev range. I.e would a step up in diameter move the power up or down?

As for fitting ect i am fortunate to have the ability to make any size/ bend i need.

Hence the questions really, as with the tools i have now available i want to experiment in the manifold department.

My build thread: http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=454802

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/85313398@N02/


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

Podland


On 18th Oct, 2014 stevieturbo said:
It would actually be nice to see the manifold over the top and dropping down into the turbo.

then the intake section would suffer less from heat soak, as the heat would rise away from it

Would also leave a little more room possible for the downpipe to escape


Bugger, I now have design number 4 buzzing around in my head.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

Podland

On 18th Oct, 2014 danb41 said:
Interesting, i wonder what particular effect it would have on power in the rev range. I.e would a step up in diameter move the power up or down?



You will never know unless you simulate it.

EDIT: This describes what happens when you introduce a step change in the runner:


So you effectively send a negative pressure pulse back towards the exhaust valve earlier than the main wave coming back from the collector. Hence I would expect it to improve the top end, if the rest of the engine can benefit from it.

Edited by Paul S on 19th Oct, 2014.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


stevieturbo

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Northern Ireland




On 18th Oct, 2014 Paul S said:

On 18th Oct, 2014 stevieturbo said:
It would actually be nice to see the manifold over the top and dropping down into the turbo.

then the intake section would suffer less from heat soak, as the heat would rise away from it

Would also leave a little more room possible for the downpipe to escape


Bugger, I now have design number 4 buzzing around in my head.


Try and find a twin scroll turbine housing too...make the most of the port design.

Tube size is another very debatable one. I'm guessing most are using around 1.5" ?

I'd nearly think given the small engine capacity, small ports and valve sizes...approaching 1" ID probably wouldnt hurt anything at all ?

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


Paul S

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Formerly Axel

Podland

Pointless making the runners from the 1.5" stainless stuff as the pulses are too small to do any good.

You can see from the picture above, the plot of the pulses shows how the pulse amplitude reduces as the pipe gets bigger. You need the amplitude to get the exhaust pressure lower than the inlet pressure during overlap.

I use the 1" NB stuff which is about 28mm.

My simulation suggest that the optimum for both the 998 or 1293 is 28mm bore for the outer cylinders and 31mm bore for the centre branch.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

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