Inlet Manifold Design
Turbo Mini Forums

New design for the Miglia attached.

Much simpler. Should fit, but will need custom exhaust manifold for turbo. Also have to work around clearance with the clutch master cylinder.

Based on the slimmer Siemens type injectors.

I've ordered enough material to make 3/4 so may be able to sell some.

Attachments:

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Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Id be very intrested In one Paul Let me know when you are ready to start and a price we can work from there :).

The clutch master cylinder is exactly the same problem I have when trying to put two injectors like that, slightly worse because the "standard" (ie, Bosch, Weber etc.) are bigger so have to be further apart.

Are you staying with stainless or going to try aluminium ???

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

This is going to be in aluminium this time.

I've gone for 16swg. Just hope I can weld it OK.

I'll just be making one for now. If it works OK, then I may offer them for sale, but not before the summer is over.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

it will be fine to weld apart from maybe the injector bungs.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

I'm just about to start yet another manifold. This time for the second evolution of the 998Ti.

Staying with stainless as I hate welding aluminium with a vengance. It will be a bit heavier, but may be better as far as heat transfer is concerned.

I'm going to fit a taper to the end of the plenum instead of the centre inlet, but otherwise much the same.

This is a CFD model of the original:


This is a CFD model of the Miglia one:


So a combination of the above.

I was thinking of making the runners longer with a tangential exit from the plenum - any thoughts.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Just what I was thinking until I noticed the missing i

If something is worth doing, it's worth doing half of.

If the runners are bend say at 30°, the plenum would be made higher, away from the turbo ?
(and why not up to the bulkhead ?)

But maybe it can create clearance issues with the injectors ?

Rusty by nature

Yes i moved to the darkside

Instagram @jdm_brett

Yes, this will also have a side mounted turbo.

I'm really just trying to improve on the 998Ti manifold with the S shaped runners as it works so well.

I have to take the inlet on the rad side of the plenum as the turbo is going to be t'other side.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

I've made some changes to the area around the injector bosses, principally to get them the same distance from the valves. This follows on from Graham T's experience with staging injection.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Spray pattern springs to mind ...

But as it has been proven otherwise, I guess it is OK.

What about the higher injector protuding in the inlet in order to have the lower injector closer to the inlet ?

Rusty by nature

Very interesting work Paul.

What CFD package do you use? Is it Star CCM?

Spray is an issue. The injectors have a 26 degree cone spray pattern. With the above design, there is a slight interference with the spray at the base of the lower boss. However, the same sort of scenario exists in the existing 998Ti manifold and does not seem to cause major problems.

I could push the lower injector further in, but I'm trying to minimise major changes to the fuel slug on the transition from single to two injectors per port.

I use Solidworks for the simple CFD stuff. Is Star CCM any good?

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

I haven't used Solidworks for CFD work before, so wouldn't be able to say what the limitations are or if Star CCM is any better.

I only used Star CCM for a year for my final year dissertation, so still a novice by all means. I guess a lot of the set up such as the physics models, the mesh size etc is very similar to Solidworks. One handy feature i used with Star CCM is creating volumetric controls, so in areas of interest you can reduce the mesh size. The limitations were mainly the poor university computers

what program are u guys using to design the inlet manifold?

I use Autocad for the general layouts. The CFD was done with Solidworks.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

cool just wanted to have a play

Paul,
Here is a thread about inlet design on an turbo-ed Nissan or Datsun plenum/inlet manifold with a lot of CFD also movies.
I didn't read it all, I don't know if it's of any use to you (especially as her has 6 runners) but I thought I should share.

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/...-intake-plenum/

Thread dies all of a sudden but CNC end result must be seen!

Rgrds,
Han

Edit: Kinda dumb not putting the actual link in..:$

Edited by Yo-Han on 21st Dec, 2010.

Dazed and Confused....

Here is some interesting info about bellmouths:

http://www.profblairandassociates.com/pdfs...lmouth_Sept.pdf

Dazed and Confused....

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

That does sound logical...
Might just be the reason why the thread ended all of a sudden

Dazed and Confused....

Slight change of plan:

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."